Osamu Suzuki × Kenji Yajima Discuss Talent Theory for the New Era

In this era where digital and social media empower individuals to compete based on their talents, how are talents born? What lies ahead for the talent business?

Broadcast writer Osamu Suzuki, who has witnessed the evolution of talent firsthand. Kenji Yajima, CEO of talent agency Twin Planet (home to Nana Suzuki, Akari Suda (SKE48), and the Yoshiaki/Michi siblings) and content producer. They were joined by Tomoya Okutani, who drives business development in digital and technology at Dentsu Digital Inc., to hear their perspectives.

From left: Kenji Yajima (Representative Director, Twin Planet), Osamu Suzuki (Broadcast Writer), Tomoya Okutani (General Manager, Integrated Marketing Production Division, Dentsu Inc.)

The Rise of Social Media Has Changed How Talents Emerge

Okutani: Lately, I feel like new types of talent are emerging more frequently from digital and social media, changing how talent is born. How do you two feel about this?

Suzuki: The era when stars were born from television is changing. I recently wrote the script for the drama "M: There Was Someone I Loved" (hereafter "M"), and I think it's becoming harder to produce stars like Ayumi Hamasaki nowadays.

Fundamentally, when you think about "What does it mean to be successful?" before, if you were on TV, you were considered "successful." But now, there are so many definitions of "success."

Okutani: It's interesting that the definitions of "being successful" have increased.

Yajima: Today, there are many media platforms for achieving "success" – YouTube, SHOWROOM, TikTok, Instagram, and more. Talent has also become more specialized. You have people famous only on Instagram but unknown on YouTube, or famous on TikTok but unseen on TV, so most people don't know them. It's an era where overwhelmingly famous stars known by everyone are hard to come by, and instead, we have talents thriving on specific social media platforms.

Suzuki: History always changes, just like how TV replaced movies as the star-making platform back then. But for a long time, no one could imagine anything replacing TV. We believed TV was the undisputed king...

Yajima: Of course, TV still has its value today, but it's no longer the be-all and end-all. The same applies to talent. Talent is such an abstract concept, right? I feel that going forward, we'll see more success for people with specific titles, like mentalist DaiGo, or those closer to being experts.

Suzuki: You don't need 10 million or 20 million supporters. A talent with 10,000 passionate fans can thrive. For example, a talent earning 100 million yen – traditionally, that meant being a frequent TV host or a successful musician, with limited methods. Now, there are many more ways.

Okutani: That's true. Monetization has diversified. Even with just 10,000 fans, if each fan's passion and engagement is high, it's possible to earn a lot.

Unpredictable!? How Talents Succeed in the New Era?

Suzuki: What's different from the past is that successful talents can now earn independently. For example, an ordinary high school girl could become a charismatic figure with 10,000 followers if the false eyelashes she designed become a hit and sell well.

Yajima: Nowadays , the ways to become popular are truly diverse, and talents also strategically use different media to express themselves. Talents who excel at still images and know how to present photos well focus on Instagram, while those skilled at video leverage YouTube or TikTok. If they become a hot topic on that platform, TV picks them up, leading to even more followers and increased recognition.

Suzuki: A recent example is the incredible momentum of the music unit YOASOBI, which gained traction from "monogatary.com," a site for posting novels and illustrations. They created the song "Yoru ni Kakeru" based on the novel "The Temptation of Thanatos" posted on the site. The synergy with the novel sparked buzz, and their YouTube music video also became popular.

Then, they appeared on "THE FIRST TAKE," a popular YouTube channel featuring one-take performance videos by famous musicians. They released an original arrangement there, which exploded again, surpassing 20 million views. After that, "Mezamashi TV" featured them. All this happened in just a few months.

Yajima: YOASOBI's worldview is really stylish, isn't it? It resonated with celebrities too. Shingo Katori posted a cover video of the same song on YouTube, and that became a hot topic as well.

Suzuki: Ayase from YOASOBI mentioned on the radio, "It's absolutely not enough to just make good stuff." Many YouTubers say this too—you need to analyze keywords and such to get related videos suggested. Essentially, you can't just be a creator; you have to be a producer too.

Yajima: Traditionally, the process was: "We've finished a song," then you'd perform it at live houses or events, mobilize an audience there, invite media, and spread awareness that way. But YOASOBI took a completely different approach and became incredibly popular at an astonishing speed. I think a lot of adults now feel that how things sell has completely changed, the speed is faster, and it's unpredictable.

Okutani: So creators with strong production skills hold overwhelmingly greater value, right?

YouTubers' TV strategies resemble athletes'

Yajima: TV casting also consciously considers the internet and social media, right? Many appear on TV with credentials like "huge on TikTok" or "huge on YouTube." These talents seem to view TV as just another media platform to leverage.

Suzuki: Exactly. A YouTuber I know said something like, "YouTube is way more profitable than TV. But appearing on TV lets me show a different side than on YouTube, so it's a valid strategy for boosting recognition."

Okutani: It's interesting how they deliberately create a different persona for TV appearances.

Suzuki: They want to appear on TV to amplify their YouTube revenue. If viewers could see the same content on TV, it would undermine the value of their main channel. In that sense, YouTubers are like athletes. Stoic professionals. Like how an athlete is different on the field versus when they're on TV.

Okutani: That's the essence of an athlete. There's a stage to compete on, and results are clear as scores. So, is the order social media first, then TV?

Suzuki: I think that trend exists. Lately, it's become incredibly common for TV to feature things that are trending online or on social media.

I know a lot of YouTubers personally, and at TV station meetings, you hear ideas like, "What if this celebrity collaborated with that YouTuber?" or "Let's get this celebrity to start a YouTube channel." Lots of proposals come up, but I think they're all pretty difficult. It's not that there are absolutely no celebrities succeeding on YouTube, but fundamentally, few celebrities are willing to stake their entire career on YouTube alone. And beating YouTubers who have dedicated their lives solely to YouTube is incredibly tough.

How can TV become more interesting?

Okutani: As TV and digital media coexist going forward, what kind of win-win relationship could they form?

Suzuki: I think "M" has established one successful model so far. This drama was a co-production between TV Asahi and ABEMA, which allowed for a larger scale. After TV Asahi aired it on terrestrial broadcast, they didn't offer any catch-up streaming on TVer; instead, everything was streamed exclusively on ABEMA Video.

Compared to an internet TV station producing a drama alone, pairing it with terrestrial broadcast results in video views increasing by an order of magnitude. Television's influence is truly formidable. I think we'll see more collaborations between terrestrial and digital platforms going forward.

Also, TV should maintain its pride and create content it genuinely finds interesting without pandering. That said, the connections of people with creative ideas and the power of external producers are absolutely essential.

Yajima: Exactly, it's about division of labor. TV has its role. Instead of trying to wrap everything up on TV alone, we create content by understanding each platform's role. When TV and the internet respect each other, new approaches to talent involvement will likely emerge.

Suzuki: Monetization might change too. For example, if a talent brings a sponsor to TV, they could get royalties. The system could shift so revenue isn't just for the broadcaster, but everyone gets paid based on their contribution.

Okutani: That's interesting. It might enable a new, sustainable incentive structure.

The Talent-Production Relationship: Starting from Zero to One

Okutani: Talent agencies are also seeing changes in how the talent business operates, right?

Yajima: That's right. Those who can earn money are increasingly able to do so without being affiliated with a production company or appearing on TV, fundamentally changing the business model that talent agencies have relied on.

The crucial thing is how to draw out the untapped appeal within the talent themselves. I believe the future role of a production company is to objectively assess a talent's value, consider all avenues—not just television, but also how they express themselves on social media, their individuality, and their story—and then find and propose suitable platforms and partners.

Our company has launched a new service called "Business Personal Ship." This service focuses on diverse individuals active in various fields, regardless of whether they belong to an agency, have their own office, or are freelancers. It provides only the specific support each individual needs.

This includes support for outreach to mass media, risk management for online defamation or rights infringement, assistance with project financing and other funding, accounting and tax filing, and dispatching on-site managers. Leveraging the expertise cultivated as an entertainment production company, it's a service designed to meet the diverse needs of individuals pursuing entertainment careers. It's about division of roles, rather than the production company managing every single aspect for the talent.

Okutani: When a talent's abilities are combined with new business opportunities, the returns can be significant. That's where the need for a producer who can arrange these opportunities comes in.

Suzuki: In the past, when someone wanted to become a celebrity, the production company would build their value from zero to one. But now, talents can build that value from zero to one on their own. Going forward, the production company's role will be about how to grow beyond that initial one.

For example, suggesting to a popular TikTok talent, "Wouldn't it be amazing if you appeared on 'THE FIRST TAKE'?" But actually getting on the show is a huge hurdle. I feel that now, besides TV stations, the connections agencies really need are with various media outlets and the channels within them.

Yajima: Beyond pioneering new media to grow fanbases, for certain talents, we can also help develop their product production skills. The pandemic increased online shopping. Beyond traditional talent endorsement deals, if a talent has unique personality or strengths, products they produce themselves are starting to sell. Collaborating with companies while leveraging their own social media to directly reach users allows them to sell genuinely great products.

Okutani: The question is what kind of story we write for outstanding talent to help them scale. Relying solely on an individual talent's power might yield a growth rate of 1→2→3, but with production company support, it could become 1→10→100→1000. It seems new talent business models will accelerate even more going forward. Thank you for today.